Among them are anemia, rickets, cretinism, osteomalacia in children and hypothyroidism in adults. A deficiency in vitamin B12, which is very difficult to come by in plant products, can cause neurodegenerative diseases. If stores of this vitamin are not sufficient before becoming a vegan, problems could ensue. Studies show that vegetarians willing to eat dairy products are in much better shape than vegans when it comes to this kind of vitamin build up.
Even the Vegan Society and Vegan Outreach organization state that vegans must take fortified foods and vitamins to maintain a healthy diet of B12 vitamins. What is more unnatural than taking a man-made vitamin? How do vegans get off discussing the “nature” of things when their diet dictates that they pop a pill to avoid malnutrition?
Iron is another issue. It is poorly absorbed in vegetarian and vegan diets, because human beings are not meant to be strictly herbivorous — so says our vestigial cecum and our inability to digest cellulose.
Calcium and vitamin D supplementation are yet another unnatural route vegans must take to compensate their deficient diets. It is exceedingly difficult for these individuals to get the vitamin D they need from a strictly veggie diet, especially in the winter.
The bottom line here is that a vegan diet is no different from any other diet in its greatness or efficiency, or benefits. If it is improperly conducted it can lead to malnutrition, just like how an omnivorous diet can lead to complications if imbalanced as well.
Vegans need to wake up and smell the coffee. They also need to stop pushing their agenda like religious fanatics. People who eat meat are not murderers nor are they unnatural. The only thing unnatural here is having to take a man-made dietary supplement because your nutrition is not up to par.
Human beings have both plant-eating and meat-eating teeth, molars and canines respectively. We are genetically set to consume both materials.
Now that you have some facts about veganism you might understand why everyone is not jumping on the bandwagon. Vegan diets can be expensive, flavorless, culturally unattractive, dangerous, monolithic and inaccessible. It is for these reasons that most vegans, in my experience, tend to be middle- to upper-class people who have access to the needed resources to make such a diet possible, and even then they do not have the facts about healthy veganism.
Talk to a professional nutritionist if you choose to go vegan and get the facts about what you need to do to maintain a healthy diet.
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A version of this article appeared in the Apr 30 issue of the Collegiate Times.
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May I just say, not all vegans are the same. Not all vegans have the same "agenda", or any agenda at all, necessarily. Your article makes it sound like you've got some vendetta against them! What makes you think all vegans have this "agenda" you refer to?
Also, when vegans say they have an issue with eating "sentient" beings, it's kind of obvious, even if they don't specify their definition of the word, that they mean they don't like eating animals that can feel pain. They don't like to eat something that they know had to suffer a significant amount of pain in order for them to eat it. They don't feel that their taste for cheese is worth the hell some cows have likely had to go through in order for them to get it. You sound like you've done some research, but it doesn't sound like you've gotten it from a very wide amount of sources.
B-12 isn't a man-made vitamin, by the way, and humans used to be able to get it naturally without meat or dairy but can't anymore - if you actually finish your research, maybe you can figure out why.
I won't even begin to point out the problems with your other nutrition arguments.
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He does not say B12 is a man made vitamin. He refers to the man-made supplements with B12 in them. Please read the article next time.
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"What is more unnatural that taking a man-made vitamin?"
is the sentence that I remembered, and I got the context mixed up. You're right, that was my mistake.
That doesn't, however, change the fact that there are unnatural reasons why vegans can't get B-12 naturally, that really should have been mentioned in such an article.
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"I won't even begin to point out the problems with your other nutrition arguments."
I wrote this initial comment, and well, it seems that plenty of other people have done the work for me! Throughout these 100 comments are several explanations and links to REAL information explaining why nutritional points in this article are totally weak, if not completely untrue.
FOR THOSE OF YOU INTERESTED IN ACTUAL FACTS ABOUT VEGANISM & VEGAN NUTRITION, rather than just more anti-vegan blabber, I suggest you read on - or even do some real research yourself, which is more than the author of this piece appears to have done!
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"Everyone is not jumping on the bandwagon"? Umm, I'm not sure where you live or who you've been talking to, but I wouldn't be so smug in such statements. If you search "Veganism" in Google News, there will be maybe 2 in 80 articles that come up that are not in favour of veganism. You'll find articles written by food critics, who had assignments at vegan restaurants/for vegan cookbooks and surprised themselves by discovering that they prefer it to their previous diets; articles by doctors, by teachers, by students....and there are an increasing amount of articles on the subject appearing in newspapers and blogs (it seems like almost every newspaper in Vancouver has a column in it now that discusses the vegan lifestyle). Not to mention the rising number of restaurants and cookbooks becoming available. Have you ever looked in a vegan cookbook before? You said, "Vegan diets can be expensive, flavorless, culturally unattractive (hah!), dangerous, monolithic and inaccessible." This tells me that you haven't actually explored vegan cuisine, at all. Since I went vegan 2 years ago, I have eaten a wider range of delicious foods than I ever have in my whole life. Also, I work for minimum wage - produce, grains, and legumes are MUCH cheaper to live off than meat, dairy, and eggs (unless you dine at McDonald's).
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Were you frightened by a vegetable as a child?
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It is apparent you have not done your homework or any actual research on this article. If you had, you would see the abundance of errors you've disguised as "fact".
Clearly you have not seen the state of the human diet in the US. Cheese is one of the WORST foods to eat and dairy actually REDUCED calcium in the body. The human body is not designed to eat meat, nor is our digestive track designed to process it. And if you'd done any research on veganism, you'd see that most want to cause the least harm and suffering to all sentient beings, INCLUDING humans.
Any "diet" can be unhealthy or dangerous if not properly varied and nutritious. However, a vegan lifestyle consisting of whole foods, veggies, fruits and grains is by FAR healthier, cheaper, more environmentally friendly and kinder to both humans AND non-humans then an omni or vegetarian diet.
The next time you want to do some "research" on vegan lifestyles, it might help to actually try it, talk to vegans, and not make assumptions about something you clearly know nothing about. It's really unfortunate... for you, and anyone who listens to you.
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"The human body is not designed to eat meat, nor is our digestive track designed to process it."
[Citation Needed]
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Mind citing your sources with nonbiased scientific data?
Oh wait...you can't.
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I am healthier than any vegan or vegetarian that I have ever met. I'm as close to a carnivore as you can get, as I really hate vegetables and do not eat them. I eat nuts, I eat bread, I eat cereal, but vegetables do not constitute a part of my diet.
And yet I am still more fit and healthy than any vegan/vegetarian. Suck on that.
Also, "the human body is not designed to eat meat, nor is our digestive track designed to process it"? Hahaha. Where the hell have you been for the past 500,000 years?
Also, it's extremely difficult and expensive to get enough protein/iron in a diet without meat. It's also difficult to get protein with a complete amino acid profile.
And fruits are generally fairly unhealthy for you because they have so much sugar. You can get the fiber elsewhere easily.
VEGANS OWNED.
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HAHAHhahahah oh my goodness.
"I'm am still more fit than any vegan/vegetarian."
Yeah, you certainly sound like you know what you're talking about. How many vegans HAVE you met?
And, since you don't seem to be open at all to the concept of veganism period, I doubt you've ever tried it or looked into the facts - nuts, grains, legumes, my friend. All things that doctors and parents have been telling us for years that we need to get healthy dosages of, regardless of what else we eat.
You refuse to eat vegetables? What are you, two?
Fruit is unhealthy, because of it's sugar content?!
My goodness.
You know, every doctor I've ever spoken to about it - and I've spoken to many, being a biology student with an ICBC claim - has said that veganism is a very healthy diet. Not that I need them to tell me, since, you know, I've done my research - reading books is good, you know.
UNINFORMED PERSON OWNED.
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"And yet I am still more fit and healthy than any vegan/vegetarian. Suck on that."
HAH! Is that an official statistic? You sure know how build a credible argument.
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"it's extremely difficult and expensive to get enough protein/iron in a diet without meat. It's also difficult to get protein with a complete amino acid profile"
That is RIDICULOUS! Why are you even talking about this when clearly you don't care enough about it to look at the really basic facts of vegan/vegetarianism?!
NUTS GRAINS BEANS LEGUMES = PROTEIN PROTEIN PROTEIN PROTEIN, AMINO ACIDS AMINO ACIDS AMINO ACIDS AMINO ACIDS
Some quick internet searching could have told you that:
http://vegetarian.about.com/od/healthnutrition/tp/protein.htm
And would you know how difficult or expensive it is if you haven't tried it?
Ever notice how the vegetarian/vegan options at restaurants are almost always cheaper than the menu items with meat in them?
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"nuts, grains, legumes, my friend. All things that doctors and parents have been telling us for years that we need to get healthy dosages of, regardless of what else we eat. "
I eat those.
"That is RIDICULOUS! Why are you even talking about this when clearly you don't care enough about it to look at the really basic facts of vegan/vegetarianism?!
NUTS GRAINS BEANS LEGUMES = PROTEIN PROTEIN PROTEIN PROTEIN, AMINO ACIDS AMINO ACIDS AMINO ACIDS AMINO ACIDS"
Someone didn't do his research. In a vegetarian diet, soy is the ONLY complete protein. All other proteins lack a complete amino acid profile. All meat contains a complete profile. Meat > not meat in terms of amino acids.
You can't synthesize proteins if you lack some amino acids. It's like a chain with a weak link. Unless you consume massive amounts of soy and that's it in your vegetarian diet, you will not get sufficient amino acids, and are thus wasting all of the protein you're eating.
And Morningstar soy nuggets are expensive as hell as Kroger. I can get a pound of healthier chicken for the same price.
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"Protein that contains all essential amino acids is called "complete" protein. Protein that contains some, but not all essential amino acids is called "incomplete" protein. It used to be believed that all amino acids must be eaten at the same time to form complete proteins. We now know that incomplete proteins can be stored in the body for many days to be combined with other incomplete proteins. As long as all essential amino acids are in the diet, it does not matter if the proteins are complete or incomplete."
http://www.ivu.org/faq/protein.html
I'm vegan. What makes you think that means I have to buy fake chicken?
You said, "Unless you consume massive amounts of soy and that's it in your vegetarian diet, you will not get sufficient amino acids, and are thus wasting all of the protein you're eating." - That is simply not true. I'm vegan, and I keep the amount of soy I consume to a minimum. I've discussed this with my doctors, and both of them have told me that my diet is very healthy.
It's nice to see, at least, a little more of a substantial response, even if in the end it doesn't actually make sense.
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HEY EVERYBODY
QUINOA, AN INEXPENSIVE GRAIN MUCH LIKE RICE OR COUSCOUS, IS A COMPLETE PROTEIN.
So there ya go.
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Morningstar "soy nuggets" aren't even vegan, just vegetarian - they've got egg in them. Even if they were, as a vegan, I wouldn't touch them. I've got much more delicious and healthy things to eat than some processed, pricey simulation of dead bird meat.
I wish people would get over the fact that vegans don't only eat soy, and in fact many of them try to keep it to a minimum in their diet. Soy is in so many things these days, vegan or not, it doesn't seem very good to eat so much of the same thing.
And we don't need to eat things that are complete proteins, if we eat a variety of plant foods with protein in them (i.e. grains, legumes, nuts, vegetables, etc), any foods lacking in a particular essential amino acid will be covered by another. It's quite simple. I learned this in grade 12 biology. I'm no scientist, so if my explanation doesn't satisfy, go look it up for yourself.
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Plants, not animals, are the original source of all amino acids and contain every essential amino acid in abundance. Therefore, animal protein sources in the human diet are not necessary.
There is no need for careful combining of complementary amino acids to produce complete protein; any reasonably varied diet will provide ample complete protein.
The average adult requirement for daily dietary protein is 0.8 grams per kilo of healthy body weight. This works out to 55 grams for a 135lb person or 68 grams for a 165lb person. Most North Americans consume close to double the recommended amount. Excessive dietary protein can lead to increased calcium excretion and kidney damage, and has even been linked to cancer.
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Even Wikipedia can tell you that it's no problem getting a complete amino acid profile just from plant foods:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complete_protein
THIS ARTICLE IS FULL OF BS!
The author didn't even complete basic research, and possibly didn't even complete high school biology.
Also, there are no studies that indicate that vegans/vegetarians have a higher iron-deficiency rate than meat-eaters - actually, studies indicate that there is no outstanding difference in incidences between the groups.
Vitamin C as well as meat protein aid humans in the absorption of iron, and vitamin C is super easy to get.
As for calcium and vitamin D - and we get plenty of vitamin D from the sun, by the way - this website lists a number of sources, including many plant/plant-based sources of foods that contain calcium and that contain vitamin D.
http://www.healthlinkbc.ca/healthfiles/hfile68e.stm
Point: IT'S NOT AS DIFFICULT AS YOU MAKE IT SOUND FOR VEGANS TO GET THESE NUTRIENTS, in fact it's quite easy, and it is apparent that you haven't even done basic research before writing your 3-page article - or you have, and decided to omit it from your contemptuous tirade against the vegan diet and the people who adopt it (or at least those "in your experience").
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oh look! Another anti-vegan article! What a surprise!
I don't know why so many people say this is a trend when so many others are still so hostile and ignorant about veganism.
I, for one, didn't become vegan because I thought it would be something rebellious to do or to make myself "holier-than-thou" (you see that thrown around everywhere, eh?)
oh and also, I don't pop pills every day to meet my nutritional requirements.
typical assumptions.
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Not every day...
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Enjoy not getting enough of your essential amino acids because you choose to eat foods with an incomplete AA profile. Oh, and enjoy eating a more costly, inefficient diet.
Also, the author was obviously referring to the vegans you claim not to be a part of. Nobody cares about people who don't flaunt their differences. We only care about the vegans who get in our face and try to make us feel bad for eating a delicious burger.
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If you want me to start listing all the ways that vegans can get their essential amino acids, I will, but I think you would do yourself some good by doing a little reading all by yourself.
As for more costly, I spent $400 less on food this year now that I've gone vegan. What the heck makes you think that it is more expensive to NOT buy meat and dairy?!
And "inefficient"? Sounds like you're getting desperate.
"Nobody cares about the vegans who don't flaunt their differences." Ooooookay. So where did it say that in the article? I heard blanket statements galore. "Vegans need to wake up and smell the coffee." Not, "Preachy self-righteous close-minded vegans need to wake up and smell the coffee." If this was meant to be obvious, then the article is even crappier than it was with all its other flaws.
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"Many vegans I have spoken to state... "
Doesn't sound like a blanket statement to me. He explicitly says "many vegans I have spoken to".
"If you want me to start listing all the ways that vegans can get their essential amino acids, I will, but I think you would do yourself some good by doing a little reading all by yourself. "
Soy is the only vegetarian complete protein. All others are incomplete.
"As for more costly, I spent $400 less on food this year now that I've gone vegan. What the heck makes you think that it is more expensive to NOT buy meat and dairy?!"
If all you eat is raw produce then sure, veganism is cheaper. But not healthier. Ever notice why most vegans look scrawny as hell and malnourished? I've never seen a vegan look healthy. I've seen plenty of pescatarians and omnivores who look healthy, but never a vegan.
"And "inefficient"? Sounds like you're getting desperate."
It is. If two people eat a steak or a salad, the steak-eater will have much more energy. The salad (although it fills you up, sure) is nowhere near as energy-dense as the steak is (which also fills you up).
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Just because a person doesn't buy meat and dairy DOESN'T MEAN ALL THEY EAT IS RAW PRODUCE! Vegans eat things like mashed potatoes, peanut butter & jam sandwiches, spaghetti, COOKED PRODUCE - what, did you think olive oil had dairy in it?
The fact that you are under this impression just proves that you have no idea what you're talking about.
You seem so desperate to NOT know anything about veganism, and just bash it!
And you're not even right about the protein thing. Do a quick search on the internet and you'll find out easily why a vegan diet is perfectly sufficient in protein levels.
As far as the "many vegans I have spoken to", that is maybe the one time in the whole article where that is specified. "Vegans make the claim..." "Vegans tend to..." "Vegans need to wake up and smell the coffee..." among several others sure sound like blanket statements to me.
Your bad experiences with a couple vegans doesn't exactly warrant your writing a whole article seeming to want to the idea as a whole. Stop being so judgmental - not all vegans are "scrawny and malnourished". That's a total stereotype! I've even met a couple of overweight vegans. Just because YOU haven't met any "healthy-looking vegans" (by your noble analysis) doesn't mean they don't exist.
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If you think that all vegans look scrawny and malnourished, check out this list of vegan celebrities and think again:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_vegans
Also, "scrawny and malnourished"? Way to latch onto a stereotype!
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Wow, happy to see another ignorant article written in the CT! The vegans truly appreciate your insight, er, generalizations in which any "informed" vegan will neutralize in a heartbeat. And we also appreciate you labeling the bulk of us as western, overprivileged yuppies - - if you had spent 5 minutes checking into the history of veganism you'd realize that its roots come from eastern religions, which I'm pretty sure are synonymous with the Eastern Hemisphere, and historically not particularly the epitome of "wealth". I'm also fairly certain globalized agriculture did not exist in the formative years of these religions, so it's be reasonable to assume that their required food supply was probably grown within walking distance, eh?
I also understand that columnists are required to pick and choose their arguments to make their point. I'd recommend that you speak to any water resources professional about the exorbitant amount of water required for one cow, and the implications it has on our global fresh water supply, then rewrite your article.
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I've got all day tomorrow, too!
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All that from an American...really? Are you serious Evan?
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"The vegans truly appreciate your insight, er, generalizations in which any "informed" vegan will neutralize in a heartbeat."
Yet you are unable to?
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"I'd recommend that you speak to any water resources professional about the exorbitant amount of water required for one cow, and the implications it has on our global fresh water supply, then rewrite your article."
Water is a renewable resource. Fail. Whatever you drink you'll piss out and then it'll get purified back into drinking water. Same goes with the water required to raise a cow.
Also, I hope you only take 5-minute showers and use low-flow toilets so you aren't a hypocrite.
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Didn't you learn Grade 5 Science? The water cycle takes time. We're taking water from the sources more quickly than it can replenish itself. It takes 1300 gallons of water to produce 1 hamburger. There are people in the world who can barely get any water at all due to sources drying up for a number of reasons, one of which is the fact that we're using it all up too quickly. This information is at your fingertips - just Google it! But I'm guessing you probably don't want to know.
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Anonymous, you are really smart.
(That was sarcasm, in case you missed it).
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Why isn't Anonymous smart?
They came up with a more sensible response than you did. Would you care to elaborate on why there is NOT a global water crisis? Because I've heard several things in the news and scientific journals that indicate that there IS.
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Oops! I just realized that you could have been referring to the original Anonymous (with their "Fail" comments) rather than the response anonymous. That makes more sense.
MG, have you picked up a National Geographic lately? One of the issues they just put out specifically covers the global water crisis. Check it out...please.
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And by MG I meant MG/Anonymous...this is a confusing format for discussion!
http://www.nationalgeographic.com/signsandsolutions/
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"There are people in the world who can barely get any water at all due to sources drying up for a number of reasons, one of which is the fact that we're using it all up too quickly."
What countries other than third-world ones or countries with no infrastructure for water?
And last I checked, people are complaining about sea levels rising.
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Just because sea levels are rising doesn't mean that people have more drinking water.
Go pick up that National Geographic. Or check out their website.
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Wow. The OP really does have a hate-on for vegans doesn't he? He's managed to include just about every vegan-bashing generalization out there, and all in a single opinion piece (I won't dignify this bile by calling it an article). I've got better things to do than spend all day refuting all of the ridiculous misinformation here, other than to say that every statement made shows an extreme prejudice towards, and complete lack of information about vegans and the vegan diet.
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At least he took the time to explain all of his beefs with veganism. He didn't just ridicule it and walk away proclaiming victory. You should try to write a more substantial response (I won't dignify this bile by calling it a post) next time.
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Aaaawww, did you want us to give it to you simply so that you don't have to go and do any actual research all by yourself? Are you scared to go ask your doctor? Do you have a doctor? You obviously have the internet, so I suggest that you spend your time on it learning about this stuff yourself before you try to argue against it, rather than proceeding without informing yourself and then acting like everyone else is stupid because they can't be bothered to spell it all out for you. Go! "Vegan nutrition"! Google it! Just do it!
We can't be bothered to list to you all the healthy aspects of veganism. There are TOO GOSH DARN MANY, you little whippersnapper! Have fun with your reading.
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So you still can't list a single benefit to being a vegan. Gotcha.
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Ooooo Mr. Snappy 2-sentence response guy is back.
When you were busy trying to think of something clever to say, you could have Googled "Veganism benefits" and had a whole list of information come up for ya. Is that too much thinking for you or something?
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I don't know where everyone gets the idea that veganism has to be so expensive!!!! Not all vegans have to shop at Whole Foods, you know!
Vegans eat NORMAL FOOD - fruits & vegetables, grains, nuts, legumes. All things that EVERYONE is supposed to get a good regular dosage of anyway, and the Food Pyramid has been telling us so since we were kids! All of these foods are available at every single supermarket there is.
A healthy NON-vegan diet would include these foods as WELL as meat/dairy. All vegans are doing is cutting out the animal products - which are hardly the cheapest on the shopping list.
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Wow... were you beat up a lot by vegans, as a kid, or what? You seem to have a bit of an axe to grind! Veganism works for a whole lot of folks... so what's it to ya? Don't like it, don't do it... I feel better than I ever did eating the animal junk; don't much care if you follow suit or not. I feel *no* desire to go back to eating animal fat & protein; so I won't. We're both happy... what's your problem?
Is your 'beef' (haha, a pun!) that you think vegans are trying to tell you what to do? (just for the record: not! munch carcass all you want! I just choose for me) If so... do you appreciate the irony that you're doing *exactly* that same thing, with this article? I find that very amusing.
Regarding b12... how many omnis eat fortified cereal, lol? or take a daily multi? what a joke of a non-issue... shoes aren't 'natural'... neither are cars or indoor plumbing. What does that have to do with anything? Geez, it amazes me what passes for logic on the internet...
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This article is a joke!
Vegans don't talk about the horrors of on-the-job injuries endured by people working in slaughterhouses because that is not the point.
People go vegan because they disagree with the treatment/consumption of animals, not because they are concerned about the well-being of the people who mistreat/murder them.
Vegans may care about the well-being of humans as well, but if you ask them why they're vegan, then no, they're not going to say that they're trying to prevent injuries being caused to humans who are doing infinitely more damage to an infinite amount of other living animals, on a regular basis, and getting paid to do it.
Just in case it comes off this way, I'm not saying that slaughterhouse workers DESERVE to get injured - I'm just saying that it is a completely different issue.
If you think it's so terrible what happens to PEOPLE in slaughterhouses, then okay...you can do whatever you want about that.
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Thanks for proving his point. Love you.
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And what point, exactly, did I prove?
His point appeared to be that vegans are unreasonable because they put the well-being of non-human animals before humans. I explained that vegans don't necessarily put the well-being of these animals before that of humans, it's just not the reason why they've gone vegan. That's not what veganism is about.
Veganism is about the way that humans treat other animals, not about how humans treat other humans. A vegan could also be a human rights activist and not eat meat for the same reason, but if you ask them about veganism, that's not what will come up.
I've spoken with several vegans actually who have told me more about the injury statistics of slaughterhouse workers than anything in this article has. In addition, most documentaries about vegan/vegetarianism, factory farming, and/or animal agriculture in general put at least 10 minutes into discussing it. I'm guessing you haven't seen any.
I should also note that I MYSELF AM NOT VEGAN, and I am STILL able to understand this.
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"Dictionary.com
Vegan - a vegetarian who omits all animal products from the diet."
That doesn't necessarily have anything to do whatsoever with human beings. Just because someone chooses to eat a certain way doesn't mean that they don't care about people!
You're totally clutching at straws.
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"Vegan - a vegetarian who omits all animal products from the diet."
See? Vegans DO care about humans. After all, humans are animals too! Hahaha...point is:
Veganism is about DIET. There are vegan activists, not all of whom argue the same way. SOME of them may put animal lives before human life, but it's not fair to go around talking like that's what all vegans do. It sounds like just another attempt to belittle the whole idea.
It's like saying that all omnivores are cold-blooded killers. I've got 3 vegan friends, and they're all going out with/married to omnivores, so I'm pretty sure all vegans don't feel that way.
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Humans in general, vegan or not, primarily get their Vitamin D from THE SUN.
It is naturally synthesized through our skin when exposed to direct sunlight.
Vitamin D is present in very few foods in general. The fact that the majority of these few foods are animal products (fatty fish, beef liver, eggs) is not a huge issue for vegans, since even if you aren't vegan, I don't imagine you're eating more of these products than you are being outside (or, one would hope). Another source of Vitamin D for non-vegans is cow's milk - which is fortified with it. Vegan milks are often also fortified.
Of course there are variables depending on where you live, but ultimately, the Vitamin D thing is kind of a weak argument.
As far as winter goes: Our bodies are capable of storing vitamins. If you get lots of sunshine in the summer, your body stores that Vitamin D up and it is (typically) enough to keep you healthy through the winter, should winter in your city be lacking in clear days (though I live in Canada, and even when winter days are freezing cold, there are still many days when you can see the sun shine).
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"As far as winter goes: Our bodies are capable of storing vitamins. If you get lots of sunshine in the summer, your body stores that Vitamin D up and it is (typically) enough to keep you healthy through the winter, should winter in your city be lacking in clear days (though I live in Canada, and even when winter days are freezing cold, there are still many days when you can see the sun shine)."
Lots of broscience in here. Do you also not eat food during the winter because you stored up everything you ate in the summer as fat?
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Fat is not a vitamin, Einstein.
Go read about it.
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Hey! And Einstein was a vegetarian!
(speaking of people who don't get their vitamin D from beef or fish, just eggs, mushrooms, and of course, sunlight) (not sure if they had fortified milks & cereals in his time ;))
On here it says that we don't need to really worry about Vitamin D in our diet because the sun does the trick:
http://www.healthalternatives2000.com/vitamins-nutrition-chart.html
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Thank you for addressing this topic. Humans are predatory. Before modern weapons allowed us to kill tasty animals, our primary method of hunting was to outlast animals in a chase, then use a primitive tool, a rock, boulder, etc. to slaughter the animal as it neared exhaustion. Throughout history, the strong have hunted, the weak have gathered. A vegan diet would not sustain the energy necessary to live such a lifestyle now, but I suppose being a desk-jockey makes it much easier to sustain yourself on a few beans and some granola. Humans are mammals, mammals are meant to eat mammals.
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Thank you. These people are delusional. It is not that I take exception to their different lifestyle, it is the reasons they purport that bother me. Much of it is founded on complete ignorance of human biology. If they were honest and just admitted, 'I just like veggies and do not want to hurt animals', instead of saying, 'people are MEANT to be vegans and not eat meat', it would not bother me. It is the lies that irk me.
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"It's the lies that irk me." - WELL THEN - you did a crappy job of laying it out that way in your piece. Saying "These people are delusional," without specifying which people you are referring to makes it sound, once again, like you believe that all vegans believe the same things and behave in the same "delusional". Makes you sound JUDGMENTAL - CLOSE-MINDED - DISRESPECTFUL - IGNORANT.
Also:
VEGANS DON'T JUST EAT VEGETABLES!!!!!!!
Your piece AND comment(s) are full of what sound like stereotypes, further suggesting that you don't really know much about veganism. I've read much literature on the subject, and not a single piece of writing or media has tried to tell me that humans were "meant" to be vegan. Sure there are some people out there preaching that anyway, but it's unfair to talk as though that's what the majority of vegans do, especially when the most popular books/docs touching on the subject don't talk that way at all.
***There have been pieces I've read that suggest it is not healthy for humans to be consuming the breast milk of another animal, but none that have said that it is unnatural for humans to eat meat or eggs.
I suggest you do some real research next time before you decide to write an article describing a large and varied group of people and their lifestyles.
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This is the bottom line...if these people were thrown into the woods and told to live without technology whatsoever they would die without meat. Why? Because they would not have modern conveniences to facilitate their new-age habit. No culture...before western influences and globalization, disregarded animal products entirely from their diet. That is because without those two keys you cannot live vegan.
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VEGANISM IS NOT A NEW-AGE HABIT. There have been people eating plant-based diets for hundreds of years. Go read about it.
Also - and I'm not saying that this means that every human would live to be 100 if they went vegan, but it might interest you to know - one of the world's oldest living dogs on record was raised on a 100% vegan diet. (Dogs are omnivores just like humans, and if they eat a proper vegan diet, they can thrive on it just like humans can). (Cats, however need meat).
Also: Have you ever tried living in the woods without any "modern conveniences" for a large enough amount of time to test your theory?
What kinds of "modern conveniences" do you think people on a vegan diet need in order to eat only plant foods?
Have you ever tried being vegan for a week?
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A plant based diet is not a vegan diet. A vegan diet is made entirely of plant matter...with no animal products. That is not plant based. That is just PLANTS.
A well balanced vegetarian and omnivorous diet is plant based.
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Unfortunately, omnivorous diets these days are actually more meat-based than plant-based, which doctors have been saying is the problem.
I don't believe that all people should necessarily become vegan, but it would probably be for the best if people ate more fruits/vegetables/grains than studies have been saying they are...
Also, the term "plant-based" is often used as an adjective for the noun "food", indicating that this food came from plants - i.e. cereal, salads, pasta... the list goes on! Any number of dishes that could be vegetarian/vegan have been described as "plant-based" dishes.
I'll take this opportunity to remind, as well (since a lot of people think that veganism is so outrageous), that several foods that are very common happen to be vegan, or as some people use to describe them, "plant-based" - pasta, bread, potato chips, pure dark chocolate, many brands of chocolate chips, peanut butter....
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Oats are plant-based, but they aren't plants, are they? Nope. Bread? Potato chips?
Vegans aren't eating just plants - they don't live off salad. They're eating foods that come from plants.
Next time you have a peanut butter and jam sandwich, think about that!
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No, actually, they're not...
I'm not saying that all mammals are meant to be herbivores, and I'm not saying that humans are meant to be herbivores, but all mammals are not "meant" to eat other mammals.
(Monkeys, whales, deer, horses, elephants, giraffes, zebras, kangaroos, COWS...)
I'm vegan, and I don't worry myself at all about what other people eat. I don't go around pretending like I know that the world would be a better place if everyone ate just like me. And I don't go around spreading misinformation to people trying to convince them that their diet is unnatural or damaging to human/environmental health.
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yeah? well a lot of your buddies do. and it is gettin' a little annoying.
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vegans and carnivores need to just stop. stop the arguing, particularly in this forum. its not getting anyone anywhere...everyone marches to their own drum. end of story. i'm vegan, and i don't preach to anyone...if they ask my opinion, THEN i share it. otherwise, i keep my opinions to myself.
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NO ONE IS A CARNIVORE! NO HUMAN BEING CAN SURVIVE ON JUST MEAT!
If you are not vegan than you are an omnivore. My God...it is like vegans, in order to demonize people who eat meat, need to relate them to lions to get their point across. It is their favorite buzzword.
Get a grip you crazies. No one is a carnivore.
Oh...and can any of you vegans name a centenarian who was vegan his whole life? No...you cannot.
That argument aside...living longer does not justify a diet's moral superiority. If cannibals lived the longest would we all become cannibals?
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Actually, whenever I hear someone use the word "Carnivore", it's usually out of the mouth of an omnivore. Most vegans I know have read enough about this stuff to be able to identify the difference - and also like to remind everybody that we DO have things in common: WE ALL eat plant-based foods.
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Nowhere in that post did anyone say that "All mammals eat mammals." Rather, it said that mammals eat mammals. If you want to contest the fact that mammals are not meant to eat other mammals as a source of protein, I suggest you leave your Ivory Tower and spend some time actually observing wild animals. Do you think the term "Survival of the Fittest" originated out of a gathering society? I forgive your misguidance, you're probably just hungry.
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I believe this post was in response to THIS post:
"Anonymous | # May 1, 2010 @ 9:10 PM | Flag Comment
Thank you for addressing this topic....
....Humans are mammals, mammals are meant to eat mammals."
And the post did not say anything about mammals "not [being] meant to eat other mammals as a source of protein".
If you're here just to attempt to make fun of people or deprecate their opinions rather than share valid information, I suggest you go back to high school.
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To PowaLifta:
If vegans ate only what you think they do, then maybe they WOULD be hungry. But judging by your attitude, I'm doubting you actually know much at all about what vegans eat. I suggest you go to the library & check out some cookbooks, or better yet - look around the internet to see for yourself the many thousands of things that vegans can eat.
And let me tell you, there's more they CAN eat than can't (or, will eat than won't)!
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Oats are plant-based, but they aren't plants, are they? Nope. Bread? Potato chips?
Vegans aren't eating just plants - they don't live off salad. They're eating foods that come from plants.
Next time you have a peanut butter and jam sandwich, think about that!
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We call that 'splitting hairs' where I come from.
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I don't call it splitting hairs, I call it, "true".
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PLANT-BASED = COMES FROM PLANTS
GRAINS --> COME FROM PLANTS
GRAINS ≠PLANTS
Conclusion: Vegans do not eat only plants. Vegans eat plant-based foods.
How is that splitting hairs?
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I'm vegan, and if it wasn't for globalized agriculture and factory farms, I probably wouldn't be. But globalized agriculture and factory farms are the reality at the moment, so I choose my diet accordingly.
I'm sorry that other vegans have managed to give the whole thing a bad name by being pretentious preachy freaks (FACTS are good to spread, but as someone said earlier on, facts only please, and opinions can be expressed but not forced upon), and I'm also sorry that some people are so wrapped up in the "Standard American Diet" culture that they feel that veganism is a threat or something. And I'm sorry for everyone caught up in between! (Including, in my opinion, the animals in all the factory farms)
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SOME other vegans.
Personally, I wanted to reply to this article because I'm sick of being judged just for being vegan. I'm tired of people going around bashing it without actually trying it or at least learning more about it.
I agree that vegans should not go around preaching to omnivores, telling them things that AREN'T TRUE.
But that is exactly what THIS ARTICLE DID. I think that omnivores should do us the same courtesy. If you don't want a certain group of people coming at you telling you lies and trying to get you to be like them....WHY ARE YOU DOING IT YOURSELF?
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This article is full of skewed, as well as outright FALSE information.
If you're going to write an article out of frustration with people being pretentious jerks to you, then WRITE ABOUT THAT - don't just write an article scorning their diet/philosophy, a diet/philosophy that MANY DIFFERENT KINDS OF PEOPLE follow, not just the potential jerks that you claim to have encountered.
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A vegan is at risk of becoming anemic the same way an omnivore is at risk of developing heart disease.
This article lists all these medical risks of veganism as if they are outstanding...shall we begin to examine the medical risks of consuming meat/dairy?
Have you got any statistics for us saying that the percentage of vegans that fall victim to these potential medical problems is greater than the percentage of meat-eaters who develop problems that are caused by their diet?
It's all about balance.
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Name the significant medical risks of consuming lean chicken or fish (inb4 mercury poisoning -- look at how old people in Okinawa live, so it's obviously a minor problem). Sure, if all meat-eaters do is eat ground beef all day long, they'll be at risk for heart problems. But not people who eat lean meat.
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They said meat in the general term of it, and they also said dairy. I hope you're not going to try to convince me that I need the breast milk of a completely different species to keep a healthy diet.
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Wow, these comments totally kicked this article's ass - in educational as well as entertainment value.
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Only because of vegans' selective perception.
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Aaaawwww keep telling yourself that.
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For those of you who think that vegans must be hungry, I'll give you an example of an extremely filling vegan meal, one that I had the pleasure of enjoying at an Italian restaurant with my family last night:
Appetizer ~ Tomato Bruschetta, Eggplant & Black Olive Crostini
Soup ~ Minestrone
Salad ~ Green w/Italian Dressing
Entrée ~ Pasta Primavera w/Garlic Bread
Dessert ~ Raspberry & Lemon Sorbetto
With tea and coffee to top it off at the end of the night.
"Hungry" was the last word I was thinking of after that!
(nor were "expensive, flavorless, culturally unattractive, dangerous, monolithic and inaccessible" words that came to mind)
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Some other family members enjoyed these options:
Salad ~ Sicilian Orange Salad
Soup ~ Tomato Basil
Entrée ~ Pesto Gnocchi
Dessert a ~ Chocolate Sorbetto
Dessert b ~ Baked Pears w/Chocolate Sauce
(Just a reminder that yes - vegans can eat chocolate!)
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Oh, man, guys! Look at all of that protein!!! Those guys must be jacked like Arnold!
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GRAINS = PROTEIN
PASTA = GRAINS
Even so, do you know how much protein people are actually supposed to get in one day? It's not one whole heck of a lot. I suggest your extend your research to something a little deeper than the surface.
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Plants, not animals, are the original source of all amino acids and contain every essential amino acid in abundance. Therefore, animal protein sources in the human diet are not necessary.
There is no need for careful combining of complementary amino acids to produce complete protein; any reasonably varied diet will provide ample complete protein.
The average adult requirement for daily dietary protein is 0.8 grams per kilo of healthy body weight. This works out to 55 grams for a 135lb person or 68 grams for a 165lb person. Most North Americans consume close to double the recommended amount. Excessive dietary protein can lead to increased calcium excretion and kidney damage, and has even been linked to cancer.
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So I did some looking around, and it seems that the websites for several popular bread brands state that for 1 slice of their bread, there is 5g of protein. With 12 slices, that means 60g in one loaf. Which means, according to Nutritional Sciences above, that it is just over the healthy amount for an average woman and just under for an average man.
Some internet research informed me that the average serving of cooked pasta contains 7g of protein.
The food described by Petra above included bruschetta & crostini, both of which have bread. Minestrone is made with pasta (grains), and often also contain beans which are known for their high-protein content. Then you have the pasta primavera, which includes protein from the pasta as well as small amounts from the vegetables, and then at least 5g more from the garlic bread on the side.
So the protein from grains would be: let's say 10g for the appetizers, 7g from the soup, 7 grams 5g for the entree, = 29g. Plus protein from the veggies, and several amino acid sources to wrap it all up.
For one meal out of the day, that sounds like plenty of protein to me!
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Mr. Driessnack, you have a remarkable talent for sounding like a complete douchebag in each and every opinion piece you write. Even when I agree with you (which I don't in this case), I always want to change my opinion just so it bears no resemblance to yours.
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I'm betting he is not concerned with your opinion. That's what allows him to write the way he does.
Stop flattering yourself.
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Awww poor Johnny!
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Wow, there is actually at least one overstatement/skewed fact/flat-out lie in nearly every single paragraph of this piece!
"Now that you have some facts about veganism..."
Facts? Uh-huh. I've learned more facts about veganism from reading the comments than from your awful "article".
And you act like vegans are the crazy pretentious ones!
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I have no problems with Vegans. I eat at least one per meal. Except for the occasional mountain lion steak, the only meat i eat is vegan.
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Oh, how witty!
....
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Anyone else notice how in all these comments, the credible-sounding arguments are the ones that are either for veganism, or against this opinion piece?
Everything else seems to be either snarky, 2-sentence jabs at vegans (in ways that are often barely even relevant to the whole point), or nonsensical and/or arrogant ramblings about how eating meat is better than veganism, that offer little or no logic/science to back themselves up.
Many of the pro-vegan/anti-article comments suggested searching the internet for answers to check their info out for ourselves, and I gotta say, I'm having a much easier time finding good things about veganism than bad.
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Stop reading sites like govegan.com or veganism.org and maybe you'll find actual information. Veganism is nowhere near as healthy as vegetarianism or a diet with meat. It's more expensive to buy stuff that contain absolutely no animal products in them (unless you want to farm it all yourself), and the foods don't have as much nutrition (incomplete amino acid profiles, low fat, etc.).
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Nice try, but I personally didn't get my info from any vegan advocacy sites. I spoke with my doctor, I read some books, and yes, I looked online, and then I went back to my doctor and checked the info that I found online.
"Veganism is nowhere near as healthy as vegetarianism or a diet with meat." - Proof? Are you a doctor, now?
"It's more expensive to buy stuff that contain absolutely no animal products in them (unless you want to farm it all yourself)" - that's total BS! If I'm going to make burgers out of black beans and grains, it's going to be much cheaper than buying stuff to make them out of beef. You obviously have no clue what you're talking about.
"the foods don't have as much nutrition (incomplete amino acid profiles, low fat, etc." - more statements that just sound like desperate attempts to discredit the whole thing, again...
Good luck with your medical degree.
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Let the vegans eat what they will. They'll never know the sublime pleasure I derive from the yolk of a squab's egg laid daintily across my morning toast.
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If you think that a vegan diet is gross, unhealthy, bland, and/or expensive, I suggest you check out some cookbooks by some (bestselling) authors such as these:
Donna Klein
Dreena Burton
Sarah Kramer & Tanya Barnard
Isa Chandra Moskowitz
Terry Romero
and other books by
T. Colin Campell, PhD
Brenda Davis, R.D. &
Vesanto Melina, M.S., R.D.
Howard F. Lyman
Joanne Stepaniak
Erik Marcus
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I'm familiar with many of the books by authors mentioned above, and there's something about them I'd like to point out:
Many of them not only include a huge variety outstandingly flavorful (and filling!) recipes, but they also include nutritional information - sometimes for each individual recipe! - explaining pretty much everything you need to know about keeping a healthy vegan diet. I'm in nutritional sciences, and I would say it's an overstatement to suggest that in order to be a healthy vegan you must consult with a professional nutritionist - there is so much info out there already. But, hey! If you wanna, there's certainly nothing wrong with being extra careful.
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Here is a list of people you may recognize - many of whom are neither scrawny, nor unhealthy, nor yuppie, nor white, nor necessarily middle-class, nor necessarily rich at the point of going vegan or at all:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_vegans
Vegans look like just your average person, and there are more of them than you think...
THEY WALK AMONG YOU....
.....DEAL WITH IT!
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This person is defending hippies, online, at 3:49 AM!
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Apparently, not only do you not know anything about veganism, but you also aren't up on your pop-culture history & vocabulary.
"Vegan" is not synonymous with "Hippie".
Get a dictionary, and a thesaurus while you're at it.
***To top it off, you also think that everybody works in the same time zone as you!***
THIS IS THE INTERNET. It exists around the whole world. Just like people who choose not to drink the breast milk of a foreign species.
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Hahahh not only does he think that his diet is the best, but he expects everyone to live in his time zone, as well!
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"Anyone else notice how in all these comments, the credible-sounding arguments are the ones that are either for veganism, or against this opinion piece?
Everything else seems to be either snarky, 2-sentence jabs at vegans (in ways that are often barely even relevant to the whole point), or nonsensical and/or arrogant ramblings about how eating meat is better than veganism, that offer little or no logic/science to back themselves up.
Many of the pro-vegan/anti-article comments suggested searching the internet for answers to check their info out for ourselves, and I gotta say, I'm having a much easier time finding good things about veganism than bad."
Tell me about it! It's pretty clear that the author of this article is biased from his allegedly unpleasant experiences with a couple of vegans, either that or he's just a totally judgmental stick in the mud. Either way, I agree with all the people saying the facts are skewed. Everything is positioned to make veganism sound like a horrible thing, and people who are vegan to sound crazy.
Veganism DOES have merit compared to other diets, in certain areas, and vice versa. The author just puts everything vegan in a negative context. Way to go, Driessnack! You're transparent.
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I understand that you're probably some naive, recently admitted college kid trying to hone his skills as a writer so he can chase his dream of making it in the world after graduation. My best advice is to keep practicing articles like these, because to be completely honest this thing was just atrocious. You don't back up any of your arguments with facts, you seem to often confuse your opinion with fact, and you're just not a very persuasive writer. You seem to be more interested in preaching to the choir than you are in presenting an honest, well thought out argument.
If writing is something you take seriously and you would like to make a career out of it, you shouldn't waste time in perhaps finding a mentor or somebody that can help mold you into the sort of person who writes things worth reading.
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I heard Sean Glennon was a vegan, therefore if you are a vegan you are an idiot.
I also heard Mike Vick was a carnivore...Who let the dogs out, wot-wot!
This is another fine article from the Collegiate Crimes.
Ut Prosim you turkeys!
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All the comments totally reaffirm the crappiness of this article!
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If you think that veganism is just something for yuppie, privileged WHITE people, I suggest you take a look at these pieces of literature:
http://www.amazon.com/Sistah-Vegan-Identity-Health-Society/dp/1590561457/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1274468848&sr=8-1
and
http://www.amazon.com/Vegan-Soul-Kitchen-Creative-African-American/dp/0738212288/ref=pd_bxgy_b_img_b
Also if you look up "famous vegans" in google you'll find several names of non-white people coming up. The whole "yuppie, white, middle-class vegan" thing is a totally stupid stereotype.
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Check it out:
http://www.afro.com/sections/arts_entertainment/story.htm?storyid=1275
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